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Cita Previa - how can a black market exist when you need to give your NIE/DNI ?

Posted: Fri Mar 10, 2023 11:20am
13 replies525 views5 members subscribed
AndrewM

Posts: 46

9 helpful points

Location: Alicante City

Joined: 20 Apr 2021

I needed a digital certificate. After spending two weeks trying to get a cita previa anywhere in the province of Alicante at any hour of any day all I got was "no hay citas disponibles" and ended up having to travel to Valencia. Then today I read an article in "La Información" referencing a black market in the buying and selling of cita previas. I just wondered how this can exist when during the process of requesting the cita you need to enter your DNI or NIE? Even if you access the system as a representative you still need to give the DNI/NIE of the person you will represent, so I don´t see how it can be done unless there are corrupt funcionarios involved? Is that what it means, a black market aided by corrupt funcionarios?

Pauline39

Posted: Sat Mar 11, 2023 10:13am

Posts: 51

46 helpful points

Location: El Chaparral

Joined: 13 Apr 2022

Posted: Sat Mar 11, 2023 10:13am

AndrewM wrote on Fri Mar 10, 2023 11:20am:

I needed a digital certificate. After spending two weeks trying to get a cita previa anywhere in the province of Alicante at any hour of any day all I got was "no hay citas disponibles" and ended up having to travel to Valencia. Then today I read an article in "La Información" referencing a blac...

...k market in the buying and selling of cita previas. I just wondered how this can exist when during the process of requesting the cita you need to enter your DNI or NIE? Even if you access the system as a representative you still need to give the DNI/NIE of the person you will represent, so I don´t see how it can be done unless there are corrupt funcionarios involved? Is that what it means, a black market aided by corrupt funcionarios?

In order to get a digital certificate in Alicante province, you need to make an appointment with Suma. We got our digital certificates last week, and it was so easy to make an online appointment - we had a choice of offices we could use.

John123456

Posted: Sat Mar 11, 2023 11:34am

John123456

Super helpful member

Posts: 1431

1041 helpful points

Location: Benidorm

Joined: 27 Feb 2021

Posted: Sat Mar 11, 2023 11:34am

The same way as there is a black market in the UK for National Insurance numbers where, I believe, can exchange hands for as much as £10K .There's always someone out to make a buck on something and everything.

Kimmy11

Posted: Sat Mar 11, 2023 8:39pm

Kimmy11

Legendary helpful member

Posts: 6869

12554 helpful points

Joined: 8 Aug 2017

Posted: Sat Mar 11, 2023 8:39pm

Hi Andrew,


There are several ways to apply for a digital certificate and, in fact, several different types.  You can apply for a FNMT certificate, which needs to be verified at your local tax office before use, and you can apply for a digital certicate or a Cl@ve at a SUMA office.  However, by far the easiest way to apply for a digital certificate is at your Town Hall.  Then your signature is provided by downloading a free app from the internet - for example, I use "Autofirma":

https://sede.mitma.gob.es/sede_electronica/lang_castellano/docs_ayuda/ayudat/navegadores/autofirma.htm

I appreciate that you've already obtained your certificate, but given the frustration you've experienced, I thought it may be helpful for other members to know they can apply for a digital certicate at their Town Hall.

Kind regards,

Kim

AndrewM

Posted: Sun Mar 12, 2023 9:12pm

AndrewM

Original Poster

Posts: 46

9 helpful points

Location: Alicante City

Joined: 20 Apr 2021

Posted: Sun Mar 12, 2023 9:12pm

Kimmy11 wrote on Sat Mar 11, 2023 8:39pm:

Hi Andrew,


There are several ways to apply for a digital certificate and, in fact, several different types.  You can apply for a FNMT certificate, which needs to be verified at your local tax office before use, and you can apply for a digital certicate or a Cl@ve at a SUMA office.  However, by...

... far the easiest way to apply for a digital certificate is at your Town Hall.  Then your signature is provided by downloading a free app from the internet - for example, I use "Autofirma":

https://sede.mitma.gob.es/sede_electronica/lang_castellano/docs_ayuda/ayudat/navegadores/autofirma.htm

I appreciate that you've already obtained your certificate, but given the frustration you've experienced, I thought it may be helpful for other members to know they can apply for a digital certicate at their Town Hall.

Kind regards,

Kim

Great info.

I knew there were different types of digital certificate but when I searched on Google most of the results pointed to the FNMT certificate and I assumed (wrongly it now seems) that it would be just as hard to get one of these as any of the others. Also wasn't aware of the SUMA offices despite living here for ages so that is good to know.

Thanks!

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Wizzy2

Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2023 4:08pm

Posts: 173

34 helpful points

Joined: 5 Mar 2020

Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2023 4:08pm

Kimmy11 wrote on Sat Mar 11, 2023 8:39pm:

Hi Andrew,


There are several ways to apply for a digital certificate and, in fact, several different types.  You can apply for a FNMT certificate, which needs to be verified at your local tax office before use, and you can apply for a digital certicate or a Cl@ve at a SUMA office.  However, by...

... far the easiest way to apply for a digital certificate is at your Town Hall.  Then your signature is provided by downloading a free app from the internet - for example, I use "Autofirma":

https://sede.mitma.gob.es/sede_electronica/lang_castellano/docs_ayuda/ayudat/navegadores/autofirma.htm

I appreciate that you've already obtained your certificate, but given the frustration you've experienced, I thought it may be helpful for other members to know they can apply for a digital certicate at their Town Hall.

Kind regards,

Kim

Hi Kimmy thank you for your info. However when we went to the Town Hall in Rojales last year, we were told abruptly that we didn’t need a digital certificate. Maybe if you speak Spanish it’s easy, but we don’t and sadly it wasn’t. 
We have not made appointment at Suma office where the staff speak fairly good English so hopefully we’ll get it right this time

Kimmy11

Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2023 4:22pm

Kimmy11

Legendary helpful member

Posts: 6869

12554 helpful points

Joined: 8 Aug 2017

Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2023 4:22pm

Wizzy2 wrote on Fri Mar 17, 2023 4:08pm:

Hi Kimmy thank you for your info. However when we went to the Town Hall in Rojales last year, we were told abruptly that we didn’t need a digital certificate. Maybe if you speak Spanish it’s easy, but we don’t and sadly it wasn’t. 
We have not made appointment at Suma office where...

... the staff speak fairly good English so hopefully we’ll get it right this time

Hi Wizzy2,

You were told that you "don't need one"?!  Any Spanish or foreign citizen, providing they are at least 18 years old and hold a DNI or NIE, is entitled to a digital certificate - you don't even have to be resident in Spain.  You should have insisted, although I appreciate that's sometimes easier said than done if you speak no Spanish.  Good luck at SUMA 👍

Kind regards, 

Kim

Wizzy2

Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2023 6:03pm

Posts: 173

34 helpful points

Joined: 5 Mar 2020

Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2023 6:03pm

Kimmy11 wrote on Fri Mar 17, 2023 4:22pm:

Hi Wizzy2,

You were told that you "don't need one"?!  Any Spanish or foreign citizen, providing they are at least 18 years old and hold a DNI or NIE, is entitled to a digital certificate - you don't even have to be resident in Spain.  You should have insisted, although I appreciate that's sometime...

...s easier said than done if you speak no Spanish.  Good luck at SUMA 👍

Kind regards, 

Kim

Thanks Kim we’ve only been over her a short while so not learned enough Spanish yet to be able to insist. 

Thanks for your advice though. 

patsyd

Posted: Sat Mar 18, 2023 1:57pm

patsyd

Helpful member

Posts: 314

86 helpful points

Location: Orihuela Costa

Joined: 12 Jan 2017

Posted: Sat Mar 18, 2023 1:57pm

Kimmy11 wrote on Fri Mar 17, 2023 4:22pm:

Hi Wizzy2,

You were told that you "don't need one"?!  Any Spanish or foreign citizen, providing they are at least 18 years old and hold a DNI or NIE, is entitled to a digital certificate - you don't even have to be resident in Spain.  You should have insisted, although I appreciate that's sometime...

...s easier said than done if you speak no Spanish.  Good luck at SUMA 👍

Kind regards, 

Kim

Sorry to sound ignorant, but what is a digital certificate please ? I have resident here, so obviously have an NIE and TIE, is this something else I need 

Kimmy11

Posted: Sat Mar 18, 2023 2:45pm

Kimmy11

Legendary helpful member

Posts: 6869

12554 helpful points

Joined: 8 Aug 2017

Posted: Sat Mar 18, 2023 2:45pm

patsyd wrote on Sat Mar 18, 2023 1:57pm:

Sorry to sound ignorant, but what is a digital certificate please ? I have resident here, so obviously have an NIE and TIE, is this something else I need 

Hi Patsyd,

A digital certificate is an electronic ID which allows you to conduct Government procedures online with, for example, Agencia Tributaria, DGT (Trafico), INSS (Social Security), etc., such as register as self-employed, get a social security number, submit personal tax returns, request Padron certificate, make immigration applications, etc.  Combined with a digital signature, such as Autofirma which you can download from the internet for free, it allows you to identify yourself from your computer or other electronic device at home, rather than having to make an appointment to visit a physical office in person.

There are different types, which give you broadly the same access.  You can apply for a FNMT certificate online:

https://www.ageinspain.org/post/digital-certificate-guide

You can apply at your Town Hall for an electronic certificate, or you can apply for a Cl@ve at your local SUMA office.

Applying for the FNMT certificate requires you to attend your local tax office for verification, and I've seen reports that Cl@ve can be clunky to use for some procedures, so I opted for an electronic certificate from my Town Hall.

Kind regards,

Kim

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