Community Of Owners - Identification and communication questions

Despite your reticence to do so, I think if someone can recommend a Calpe Gestor to you it might be worth it.

The Administrator for the Comunidad of Owners won't send mail to the UK. Surface mail would be sent to your apartment. But, here's the thing, most of the official communication now is done by email. You need to identify the Administrator and get on the email list, a Gestor should be able to do that for you. But then so could a helpful neighbour. 

Hope this may help as a starting point. If no one comes to this thread with a recommendation for a Gestor, maybe start a new one titled Can anyone recommend a Gestor in Calpe?

Steve

Many thanks Steve - we have now decided to use our lawyer to send a Burofax to the "“Comunidad de Propietarios”  ( using the old contacts and address from 2010 - not ideal). 

He's probably more expensive but at least we trust him and he knows the background. 

I sighed with relief when we evicted the tenant after spending many thousands of euros through the courts but trying to sort out the mess afterwards is becoming even more expensive and stressful. I reckon we will have to pay another 7k at least to put everything in order (including redecorating the flat which has fallen into a state of disrepair). 

Dear All

Our lawyer has sent a letter by Burofax to the address of our 'Comunidad Propietarios'  but no reply for at least 3  weeks . No-one has confirmed receipt , a notification was posted on the 'Notice Board' that the letter is available for retrieval from the local post office . It cost us 140  euros for that letter and it looks like a waste of money.

I have some old 'Comunidad Receipts'  for payments that were made to the (now failed) 'CAM' bank  and I also have a bank contract confirming our Comunidad Propietarios' name and address (with the Presidents name).  

The CP name/address, President , Administrator  were all mentioned in the court evidence that our tenant (ie. the Presidents son) used in his appeal against eviction for the last 3 years. These are the same details that our lawyer used to deliver our letter by Burofax.

It almost seems as if the 'Comunidad Propietarios'  does not exist anymore but I have the CIF and its still registered and 'active'.

There is only one other option to try and confirm what is actually happening in our block and that means telephoning a person that is still living in one of the apartments. I have an old 'Comunidad Propietarios'  annual report dated 2010  showing all the flat owners in our block , so did a search in the online directories.  

I now have a name and telephone number of a person but have no-one who can speak Spanish to ask him the following question.

1. Is there a 'contact name and address'/telephone number/email address'  for the 'Administrator'  of the 'Comunidad Propietarios' ?

Can anyone help?  If yes, please private message me and I will give you his name and telephone number.

It seems that we do not have a 'Community Of Owners' looking after our apartment block. The President (the mother of our evicted tenant) left Calpe several years ago. 

Unsure what the laws are in Spain concerning 'Comunidad Propietarios'  but I'm getting a bad feeling already that the block may be left to fall into a state of disrepair.

My brother and I have now contacted the electricity (curenergie) and water companies to try and get the supplies disconnected to discourage squatters from breaking into our empty apartment and living there.  

Unsure how much it would cost to request disconnection but I suspect it will be fairly pricey . I've also heard that if we require reconnection  (again I suspect that will be costly)  in the future, there will need to be some check on the electrics in the apartment to ensure it meets some standard.  If it fails , then the whole apartment might require rewiring and the meter repositioned outside the property. 

I can't believe we have to undergo all this stress just because of the threat of squatting. The contracts are currently in the name of the evicted tenant , therefore we are not liable to pay any outstanding bills. But as soon as we change the contract owner to ourselves a squatter may break in as use as much electricity and water they wish and we'd have to pay for it until they are finally evicted through the courts ( cost about 4k in court costs alone). The laws seem insane and we have no choice but to disconnect the supplies rather than pay some standing charge until we are able to visit , refurbish the flat and sell the property.

Hi Keith, sounds a nightmare! I don't know much that could help you except to suggest getting in touch with the Spanish Citizens Advice Bureau. I am sure there will be people on this forum who can give informed advice but perhaps a call to CAB would be useful for you also..

https://www.citizensadvice.org.es/

Rgds,

Aitch.

Hi Aitch

Yes, I already contacted CAB whose offices are located in the Town Hall and they were the ones who informed me that the President of the block (ie. our evicted tenants mother) had left Calpe years ago. They have been most helpful but for some reason refused to give me the actual year she left (maybe its all confidential information).

Actually , the 'nightmare' of squatting is affecting many people in Spain and its not just landlords who are impacted (any owner of a property, even the primary one you live in). One would hope the Government would bring in legislation to prevent someone stealing your property but they seem to be more pro-squatter. The new rules state that if the squatter manages to stay in the property undetected for 48 hours, the owner loses all rights of access to their property . The police will not get involved and one will have to go through the courts to evict them (about 1-2  years because of the court backlog and over 4k lawyer and procurador costs) . Even worse , you cannot even enter the property to remove any valuables and documents , etc and you will have to continue paying the bills (if the utilities are contracted under your name).  The squatter can also prosecute you through the courts if you try and disconnect the utilities like water and fuel .  I'm just finding it hard to believe that this situation can be allowed to continue in Spain but apparently its getting worse with mafia organisations using all the legal loopholes to make a profit from squatting.

Hi Keith,

          I had heard tales of squatters but did not realize the situation was getting so bad. Seems perverse that the owner still has to pay for the utilities whilst at the same time they cannot get the squatters evicted. 

   None of this is a comfort to us second home owners who cannot get to our properties in Spain. 

I hope that you manage to get your situation resolved, good luck.

Aitch.

Hi Aitch

I was wondering whether anyone knows how water bills are paid in apartment blocks in Spain? My elderly father (90yrs old and blind) who owns the flat in the block since 1980 doesn't have a clue and we've never been able to visit the flat since 2010 (ie. the tenant actually stopped paying his rent at that time).  The tenant claimed in court that he was paying the electricity, water and comunidad. 

I managed to track down some old electricity bill receipts and found the supplier is 'Curenergie' who have confirmed the bills are up-to-date.

I then contacted 'AGUAS DE CALPE'  giving them the address of our flat and the cadastral reference that is used by the town hall to identify each property. They have now emailed me back saying that payment of the water bill is managed by a 'general accountant' (who I think would be the 'Administrator' of the Community Of Owners). 

I can only assume that the water bills are paid from the monthly comunidad that has been paid by each apartment owner in the block.  Is this the norm in Spain for some standard water rental charge billed to a whole apartment block?  I am guessing that water meters have not been installed for each apartment because of the massive cost involved and that there is one supply point.

If this is the case, then it seems quite strange because one apartment owner can use lots more water than another but still pay the same. What happens if some of the apartment owners don't pay their 'comunidad/water bill'  ?  How do they cut off the water supply to a specific apartment ? It doesn't make any sense to me at all.

Does anybody out there have a clue?

I have lived in the same apartment for over 15 years and the water, electricity, rubbish and IBI (to the SUMA agency) bills for each apartment are paid by each owner in the main.  However, if an apartment is used by a tenant of the owner then who pays the bills depends upon what is agreed in the contract between the owner and the tenant.   

Every year there has to be an Annual General Meeting (AGM) arranged by the President and the Administrator and attended by a quorum of owners, no tenants.   If no-one volunteers to be President then the owners attending the AGM have to have a 'raffle' and one owner is chosen - it is better to have a President who lives in the block than one who does not.   There has to be someone there to sign in respect of community bank accounts, etc. and act as liaison between the owners and the Administrator(s).