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100% Property Tax !!!

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2025 10:07am
11 replies3 members subscribed
Lee 03189

Lee 03189

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100% Property Tax !!! Is this a proposed tax on buying ? Renting ? Selling ? Or All ? 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cr7enzjrymxo

tebo53

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2025 10:22am

tebo53

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Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2025 10:22am

Lee 03189 wrote on Tue Jan 14, 2025 10:07am:

100% Property Tax !!! Is this a proposed tax on buying ? Renting ? Selling ? Or All ? 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cr7enzjrymxo

Read this thread and everything will become clear:

Tax on Non EU Citizen Housing.

Steve 

Lee 03189

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2025 11:26am

Lee 03189

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Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2025 11:26am

Just read this from another FB contributor : 

Ian WilsonThis is a measured view on that story from another FB Group: "Context of the measure

In Spain, non-resident owners (those who do not live habitually in the country) already have to pay a number of property-related taxes. But in some cases, certain discounts or reductions are applied to the taxes they must pay, compared to resident owners. One of the measures that has been discussed on several occasions, and that President Sánchez has mentioned, involves eliminating those discounts for non-resident owners, so that they pay the full amount (100%) of the taxes that apply to them, without any fiscal benefits.

What taxes apply to non-resident property owners?

Property owners in Spain, whether residents or not, must comply with certain taxes. The most relevant ones are:

Non-Residents Income Tax (IRNR):

If a non-resident owner rents out the property or receives income from it, they must pay this tax on the income generated. However, if there is no income, a “minimum tax” is applied for owning the property.

Wealth Tax:

This tax is levied on the net wealth of citizens, and non-residents must also pay for their assets located in Spain. However, there is an exemption for the first 700,000 euros of wealth, which may benefit some owners. Sánchez’s proposal could involve eliminating certain exemptions or increasing taxes for non-residents.

Property Tax (IBI):

This is a municipal tax on property ownership. Non-resident owners must pay this tax just like any resident owner, although it is not affected by the proposal to pay the “100% of taxes” that Sánchez mentions."

Hi Ian - Thx for this, do you know what discounts or reductions are applied to the taxes non residents must pay, compared to resident owners ? I think the post is misleading ! - reading your post Ian, if implemented, it seems as though non residents must pay 100% of the Taxes that they are charged and they will not receive any discounts ! Not so much that buying, selling or rental taxes will increase to 100% - Cheers
aitchc1401

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2025 11:59am

aitchc1401

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Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2025 11:59am

Lee 03189 wrote on Tue Jan 14, 2025 11:26am:

Just read this from another FB contributor : 

Ian Wilso...

...nThis is a measured view on that story from another FB Group: "Context of the measure

In Spain, non-resident owners (those who do not live habitually in the country) already have to pay a number of property-related taxes. But in some cases, certain discounts or reductions are applied to the taxes they must pay, compared to resident owners. One of the measures that has been discussed on several occasions, and that President Sánchez has mentioned, involves eliminating those discounts for non-resident owners, so that they pay the full amount (100%) of the taxes that apply to them, without any fiscal benefits.

What taxes apply to non-resident property owners?

Property owners in Spain, whether residents or not, must comply with certain taxes. The most relevant ones are:

Non-Residents Income Tax (IRNR):

If a non-resident owner rents out the property or receives income from it, they must pay this tax on the income generated. However, if there is no income, a “minimum tax” is applied for owning the property.

Wealth Tax:

This tax is levied on the net wealth of citizens, and non-residents must also pay for their assets located in Spain. However, there is an exemption for the first 700,000 euros of wealth, which may benefit some owners. Sánchez’s proposal could involve eliminating certain exemptions or increasing taxes for non-residents.

Property Tax (IBI):

This is a municipal tax on property ownership. Non-resident owners must pay this tax just like any resident owner, although it is not affected by the proposal to pay the “100% of taxes” that Sánchez mentions."

Hi Ian - Thx for this, do you know what discounts or reductions are applied to the taxes non residents must pay, compared to resident owners ? I think the post is misleading ! - reading your post Ian, if implemented, it seems as though non residents must pay 100% of the Taxes that they are charged and they will not receive any discounts ! Not so much that buying, selling or rental taxes will increase to 100% - Cheers

Plays well to the anti-tourist vote to blame the foreigners for the housing shortages. No shortage of empty properties around Orihuela Costa and the authorties make a lot of money out of foreign buyers and owners.  Apparently there are 27,000 non-EU foreign speculators that are robbing the housing market of long term rentals  I do wonder if all this rhetoric will drive those looking to purchase second homes to other destinations that are more welcoming.

Rgds,

Aitch.

Lee 03189

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2025 12:12pm

Lee 03189

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Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2025 12:12pm

tebo53 wrote on Tue Jan 14, 2025 10:22am:

Read this thread and everything will become clear:

Tax on Non EU Citizen Housing.

Steve 

Hi Steve. Thx for the link - What is really concerning though is point number  " 11  Limitation on home purchases by non-resident non-EU foreigners, increasing the tax burden to 100% of the value of the property. " Can you explain this please in more detail ?                   - 

Surely they won't implememnt this !!! - It would stop most non residents from buying or selling !!! - OR - is it referring to what " President Sánchez has mentioned, involves eliminating those discounts for non-resident owners, so that they pay the full amount (100%) of the taxes that apply to them, without any fiscal benefits." 

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Lee 03189

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2025 12:38pm

Lee 03189

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Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2025 12:38pm

Nigel HampsonptrsdenooS1ah1c4hua196a77258uth5t50t8clf5g2fc1cuiig23aga9l2m · Seems only right to share on a Spain Non-Resident page so you're aware but I've turned off comments. (Admins can decide if it's worth speculating what future non-resident property changes MAY occur for current and/or future property owners in future - these are only words from the Spanish Prime Minister today).The Spanish government intends to dissuade non-resident non-EU nationals from purchasing properties in Spain, as a means of addressing the country’s housing crisis.Pedro Sánchez made the announcement today as he unveiled a series of measures aimed at solving the problem of spiralling property prices and rents in Spain."We have decided that we are going to limit the purchase of properties by non-EU foreigners from outside the EU," he told the Spanish Congress.Although more details are yet to emerge, it appears to be a case of dissuading third-country buyers by taxing them more."For them, the tax burden will be up to 100 percent of the value of the property," the Spanish Prime Minister said.It is unclear at this point what this extra fiscal burden will entail, whether property transfer tax, capital gains or other. But there is the sense that the objective is to make it less financially viable - and/or profitable - for non-resident non-EU nationals such as Brits and Americans to buy a second home in Spain.

BruceK

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2025 12:43pm

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Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2025 12:43pm

Lee 03189 wrote on Tue Jan 14, 2025 12:12pm:

Hi Steve. Thx for the link - What is really concerning though is point number  " 11  Limitation on home purchases by non-resident non-EU foreigners, increasing the tax burden to 100% of the value of the property. " Can you explain this please in more detail ?      &n...

...bsp;            - 

Surely they won't implememnt this !!! - It would stop most non residents from buying or selling !!! - OR - is it referring to what " President Sánchez has mentioned, involves eliminating those discounts for non-resident owners, so that they pay the full amount (100%) of the taxes that apply to them, without any fiscal benefits." 

Many countries have applied a non resident tax to home purchases, some due to low inventory others to add a barrier to foreigners dumping money into empty properties. They increase the purchase tax rate, stamp duty etc, goes by a number of names in the hope of dissuading purchasers. If you've seen the vast number of empty houses and apartments around various countries from Chinese, Russian etc money being dumped to get it out of their own countries, you can see why governments try various tactics to reduce this. 

L181SKY

Posted: Wed Jan 22, 2025 12:01pm

L181SKY

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Posted: Wed Jan 22, 2025 12:01pm

Imho, Spain just looks like an idiotic foolish chaotic panicking Country. .  If non Eu citizens are not able to buy, there will be thousands of EU citizens ready to buy ,and they will be hoping to grab a bargain, which I don’t believe they will get. The Spanish in the market can buy them anyway.  How will that sort the Housing crisis.  The Spanish sucked up every penny they could from anyone who bought their “ Place in the Sun” with their assumption they would be Happy lol.  Now, the worm has turned on them. I think the NON EU citizens should be looking elsewhere to buy and let Spain keep floundering. The Spanish Govt should be giving incentives to people from anywhere buying property to rent to the Spanish people at normal social rents. If they are unable to build their social housing.  Then that’s a win win.     

marcliff

Posted: Wed Jan 22, 2025 12:48pm

marcliff

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Posted: Wed Jan 22, 2025 12:48pm

L181SKY wrote on Wed Jan 22, 2025 12:01pm:

Imho, Spain just looks like an idiotic foolish chaotic panicking Country. .  If non Eu citizens are not able to buy, there will be thousands of EU citizens ready to buy ,and they will be hoping to grab a bargain, which I don’t believe they will get. The Spanish in the market can buy them a...

...nyway.  How will that sort the Housing crisis.  The Spanish sucked up every penny they could from anyone who bought their “ Place in the Sun” with their assumption they would be Happy lol.  Now, the worm has turned on them. I think the NON EU citizens should be looking elsewhere to buy and let Spain keep floundering. The Spanish Govt should be giving incentives to people from anywhere buying property to rent to the Spanish people at normal social rents. If they are unable to build their social housing.  Then that’s a win win.     

Firstly, several countries have stopped foreigners buying property for rental or holiday homes as well. The Spanish government can't do this to EU citizens due to EU rules and probably won't be able to do this to non EU citizens either, including his new proposal to stop sales entirely to non EU non residents.

As to "The Spanish Govt should be giving incentives to people from anywhere buying property to rent to the Spanish people at normal social rents." then look at one of the many other threads on this subject or the actual proposals themselves which is stating no rental tax to be paid by those actually renting at normal social rents. Plus all building projects to include a certain percentage of social renting properties only. So already part of the proposals. That would mean the second home owners wouldn't be able to do so as this would be for people who wanted to rent rather than just holiday.

As usual, looking at these things from an expat or holiday owner point of view rather than from the Spanish point of view.

I doubt the not selling or doubling the tax on non EU non residents will come about for many reasons but the Spanish government, in both press and Spanish social media, getting loads of stick due to the high rental costs and those working in cities unable to buy property or pay the rents being demanded whilst seeing thousands of properties standing empty for 70% of the year. Those rentals simply paying quite a small amount in tax whilst the rest of the money goes abroad. Then the tax, non resident tax quite low and no income tax is paid by non residents and councils lose out by not being able to claim grants for non residents not on the padron yet still have to provide street lighting, policing, repairs and so on in the many places where non EU no resident citizens are in the majority. Then the government has to take into account the many demonstrations taking place which is targeting those people Spain relies on for tourist income but then has to realise those are the ones who can actually vote for what they want whilst the tourists can't. As said before, we find it very unusual for a government to actually listen to its own people. 

Holiday makers quite happy to rent a place for 500 euro a week in the Summer but how can a normal Spanish family afford 1,000 euro a month rental all year round? And, as we all know, not many second home owners would have the property available all year round. 

L181SKY

Posted: Wed Jan 22, 2025 1:38pm

L181SKY

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Posted: Wed Jan 22, 2025 1:38pm

marcliff wrote on Wed Jan 22, 2025 12:48pm:

Firstly, several countries have stopped foreigners buying property for rental or holiday homes as well. The Spanish government can't do this to EU citizens due to EU rules and probably won't be able to do this to non EU citizens either, including his new proposal to stop sales entirely to non EU ...

...non residents.

As to "The Spanish Govt should be giving incentives to people from anywhere buying property to rent to the Spanish people at normal social rents." then look at one of the many other threads on this subject or the actual proposals themselves which is stating no rental tax to be paid by those actually renting at normal social rents. Plus all building projects to include a certain percentage of social renting properties only. So already part of the proposals. That would mean the second home owners wouldn't be able to do so as this would be for people who wanted to rent rather than just holiday.

As usual, looking at these things from an expat or holiday owner point of view rather than from the Spanish point of view.

I doubt the not selling or doubling the tax on non EU non residents will come about for many reasons but the Spanish government, in both press and Spanish social media, getting loads of stick due to the high rental costs and those working in cities unable to buy property or pay the rents being demanded whilst seeing thousands of properties standing empty for 70% of the year. Those rentals simply paying quite a small amount in tax whilst the rest of the money goes abroad. Then the tax, non resident tax quite low and no income tax is paid by non residents and councils lose out by not being able to claim grants for non residents not on the padron yet still have to provide street lighting, policing, repairs and so on in the many places where non EU no resident citizens are in the majority. Then the government has to take into account the many demonstrations taking place which is targeting those people Spain relies on for tourist income but then has to realise those are the ones who can actually vote for what they want whilst the tourists can't. As said before, we find it very unusual for a government to actually listen to its own people. 

Holiday makers quite happy to rent a place for 500 euro a week in the Summer but how can a normal Spanish family afford 1,000 euro a month rental all year round? And, as we all know, not many second home owners would have the property available all year round. 

Rubbish

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