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Tax returns for resident pensioner

Posted: Fri May 13, 2022 4:08pm
26 replies884 views7 members subscribed
Joanie53

Posts: 53

9 helpful points

Location: Salinas

Joined: 13 Feb 2020

Hi , looking for guidance re tax , we are both retired and been resident since December 2021 and we own a property here . We are in receipt of state pension and work pensions ( local authority and teachers ) 

How do we complete a tax Return and are we required too ? 

Our pensions are taxed at source in U.K. ,we don’t have a property in U.K. just our home here .

I’ve seen so much conflicting information some involving paying silly money to have it done ,I’m not sure how to proceed ,so I’m hoping you lovely people on the forum will be able to point me in the right direction with your own experiences and advice 


Thank you 

Darro

Posted: Fri May 13, 2022 7:31pm

Darro

Helpful member

Posts: 352

332 helpful points

Location: Catral

Joined: 8 Sep 2021

Posted: Fri May 13, 2022 7:31pm

So much half baked and downright dodgy advice there it's difficult to know where to start.

Particularly aggregious is -

"They may at some point ask what your worldly holdings are, but didn't this time here, and it isn't taxed upon, they just want to know"

That refers to the infamous Modelo 720 which MUST be completed if you have assets outside of Spain which total in excess of €50,000, that may include pensions for which you have drawdown options.

The onus is on you to submit the 720 NOT the taxman to ask for it!

Penalties for failure to submit on time or submitting incorrect or incomplete information can be harsh.

Unfortunately for you the deadline for the 720 was March 30th. so if you do have declarable assets you are already out of compliance and unknowingly potentially liable to a penalty.

There is no "filing fee", submitting the Modelo 100 tax return is completely free. Fees demanded by Gestors or Lawers are just that but not a penny of it goes to the tax man or to pay for the submission.

You do not need your TIE nor a copy of your passport for the Modelo 100, a Gestor or lawyer might want the TIE but only for your NIE and support number which you can just as easily give them verbally and no clue as to why they would want a copy of a passport, neither play any part whatsoever in completing the actual return.

The best advice I can give you is to go and see a reputable lawyer, and the sooner the better.

Kimmy11

Posted: Fri May 13, 2022 10:14pm

Kimmy11

Legendary helpful member

Posts: 5307

10060 helpful points

Joined: 8 Aug 2017

Posted: Fri May 13, 2022 10:14pm

Hi Joanie,

Your UK State Retirement pensions and Local Authority pension are taxable in Spain, but your Teacher's pension may be one of those regarded as a "Crown" pension, in which case it has to continue being taxed at source in the UK - you should check with that pension provider.  Under the terms of the Dual Taxation Agreement between Spain and the UK, you will only pay tax on each pension in one country, as the DTA prevents you being taxed on the same income in both countries.

I wouldn't recommend a lawyer and certainly not a gestor to complete your tax returns (the first will be unnecessarily expensive and the latter is unlikely to be qualified) - you need an Asesor Fiscal.  We use Abaco Advisers in Torrevieja, who charge a fee of €77 per person:

https://www.abacoadvisers.com/

The Spanish tax calendar runs from 1 January to 31 December each year, with the filing periods for the Modelo 720 Declaration of (worldwide) Assets between January and March, and for the Modelo 100 Income Tax Return between April and June.  So I agree with Darro, you need to seek professional help as soon as possible.  As you only became resident in December 2021, a tax expert is the best person to advise whether they can handle a late filing with the Agencia Tributaria that doesn't result in a penalty against you.

Kind regards,

Kim

Joanie53

Posted: Fri May 13, 2022 10:36pm

Joanie53

Original Poster

Posts: 53

9 helpful points

Location: Salinas

Joined: 13 Feb 2020

Posted: Fri May 13, 2022 10:36pm

Kimmy11 wrote on Fri May 13, 2022 10:14pm:

Hi Joanie,

Your UK State Retirement pensions and Local Authority pension are taxable in Spain, but your Teacher's pension may be one of those regarded as a "Crown" pension, in which case it has to continue being taxed at source in the UK - you should check with that pension provider.  Under the terms o...

...f the Dual Taxation Agreement between Spain and the UK, you will only pay tax on each pension in one country, as the DTA prevents you being taxed on the same income in both countries.

I wouldn't recommend a lawyer and certainly not a gestor to complete your tax returns (the first will be unnecessarily expensive and the latter is unlikely to be qualified) - you need an Asesor Fiscal.  We use Abaco Advisers in Torrevieja, who charge a fee of €77 per person:

https://www.abacoadvisers.com/

The Spanish tax calendar runs from 1 January to 31 December each year, with the filing periods for the Modelo 720 Declaration of (worldwide) Assets between January and March, and for the Modelo 100 Income Tax Return between April and June.  So I agree with Darro, you need to seek professional help as soon as possible.  As you only became resident in December 2021, a tax expert is the best person to advise whether they can handle a late filing with the Agencia Tributaria that doesn't result in a penalty against you.

Kind regards,

Kim

Thank you this is extreme helpful 

Joanie53

Posted: Fri May 13, 2022 10:37pm

Joanie53

Original Poster

Posts: 53

9 helpful points

Location: Salinas

Joined: 13 Feb 2020

Posted: Fri May 13, 2022 10:37pm

Darro wrote on Fri May 13, 2022 7:31pm:

So much half baked and downright dodgy advice there it's difficult to know where to start.

Particularly aggregious is -

"They may at some point ask what your worldly holdings are, but didn't this time here, and it isn't taxed upon, they just want to know"

That refers to the infamous Modelo 720 which MUST be completed if you have assets outside of Spain which total in excess of €50,000, that may include pensions for which you have drawdown options.

The onus is on you to submit the 720 NOT the taxman to ask for it!

Penalties for failure to submit on time or submitting incorrect or incomplete information can be harsh.

Unfortunately for you the deadline for the 720 was March 30th. so if you do have declarable assets you are already out of compliance and unknowingly potentially liable to a penalty.

There is no "filing fee", submitting the Modelo 100 tax return is completely free. Fees demanded by Gestors or Lawers are just that but not a penny of it goes to the tax man or to pay for the submission.

You do not need your TIE nor a copy of your passport for the Modelo 100, a Gestor or lawyer might want the TIE but only for your NIE and support number which you can just as easily give them verbally and no clue as to why they would want a copy of a passport, neither play any part whatsoever in completing the actual return.

The best advice I can give you is to go and see a reputable lawyer, and the sooner the better.

Thankyou really appreciate your help 

Joanie53

Posted: Fri May 13, 2022 10:40pm

Joanie53

Original Poster

Posts: 53

9 helpful points

Location: Salinas

Joined: 13 Feb 2020

Posted: Fri May 13, 2022 10:40pm

This post that was quoted has been deleted.

Thanks Dave is your lawyer local to this area? The one we used is too far away and not totally happy with him so would appreciate a recommendation. 

DavenJules

Posted: Sat May 14, 2022 11:25am

DavenJules

Helpful member

Posts: 299

172 helpful points

Location: Monóvar

Joined: 1 Dec 2019

Posted: Sat May 14, 2022 11:25am

Joanie53 wrote on Fri May 13, 2022 10:40pm:

Thanks Dave is your lawyer local to this area? The one we used is too far away and not totally happy with him so would appreciate a recommendation. 

Hi,

For professional advice we used Angela in Hondon de los Frailes, so fairly local.. AP Abogados [email protected] and 868 053 061

English speaking too.

They have done a lot of work for us and we are pleased.

Kind regards,

D

Stevec2x

Posted: Sat May 14, 2022 12:48pm

Stevec2x

Very helpful member

Posts: 835

501 helpful points

Location: Playa Flamenca

Joined: 23 Jan 2020

Posted: Sat May 14, 2022 12:48pm

Hi all 

Regarding income tax return - since Joanie only became resident in December 2021, she is unlikely to have been fiscally resident for the year 2021, so she has a full year to come before having to do a tax return, giving her plenty of time to gather advice? I'm sure somebody will correct me if I'm wrong.

Re Modelo 720 - does the same apply? i.e. it doesn't need to be done until next year?

Cheers 

Steve 

Joanie53

Posted: Sat May 14, 2022 1:01pm

Joanie53

Original Poster

Posts: 53

9 helpful points

Location: Salinas

Joined: 13 Feb 2020

Posted: Sat May 14, 2022 1:01pm

Stevec2x wrote on Sat May 14, 2022 12:48pm:

Hi all 

Regarding income tax return - since Joanie only became resident in December 2021, she is unlikely to have been fiscally resident for the year 2021, so she has a full year to come before having to do a tax return, giving her plenty of time to gather advice? I'm sure somebody will correct me if I'm...

... wrong.

Re Modelo 720 - does the same apply? i.e. it doesn't need to be done until next year?

Cheers 

Steve 

Sorry everyone we’ve been resident since December 2020 not 2021 . I realise we’re probably a bit late but been dealing with my husbands illness  for 6 months .

Kimmy11

Posted: Sat May 14, 2022 3:47pm

Kimmy11

Legendary helpful member

Posts: 5307

10060 helpful points

Joined: 8 Aug 2017

Posted: Sat May 14, 2022 3:47pm

Joanie53 wrote on Sat May 14, 2022 1:01pm:

Sorry everyone we’ve been resident since December 2020 not 2021 . I realise we’re probably a bit late but been dealing with my husbands illness  for 6 months .

Hi Joanie,

In that case, you should have submitted the Modelo 720 in the first quarter of this year and you must do your Modelo 100 tax return ASAP.

Good luck 👍 

Kind regards, 

Kim

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