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Solar Panels - Pros & Cons?

Posted: Wed Feb 2, 2022 8:36pm
11 replies258 views5 members subscribed
Sonja26

Posts: 42

4 helpful points

Location: Benidorm

Joined: 26 Dec 2020

Hi,

Does anyone have experience of solar panels, please?

I am interested to hear about any disadvantages more than anything!

Thanks in advance.

Sonja

Azphilosopher

Posted: Wed Feb 2, 2022 9:22pm

Posts: 20

14 helpful points

Location: Tibi

Joined: 19 Jul 2021

Posted: Wed Feb 2, 2022 9:22pm

The house I bought near Tibi is equipped with solar panels and a battery system and is completely disconnected from the grid.  I recently spent nearly a month in the house (during the winter with low sun angles) and got quite a surprise when after a few days of clouds (which are rare in the region), my power began tripping off on under voltage.  Now the house has a backup generator but it's noisy and awkward to use.  I found myself becoming much more conscious of what types of appliances I could run.  You'll want to avoid as much as possible any with resistive heating elements in them.  Some examples are an electric kettle, toaster, electric space heaters.  LED lights use extremely little power.  Most motorized appliances are fairly energy efficient but you have to be aware of their current draw. 

I look forward to the summer months when the solar cells will be so much more efficient.  Whether my bank of batteries is sufficient, I'm not sure.  Now the good news.  The EU countries are extremely supportive of alternative energy and prices are inexpensive for decent systems.  I will probably add on to the system and storage so that I can install AC units on some rooms and I'm tempted to put up a small wind generator to see how much I can supplement on cloudy days.  If I find that I'm still lacking I'll be tempted to change the system to a grid-tie system if the electric utility will do that. 

For now it's great to know that I have no electrical costs to live in the house.  I look forward to being there full time once my residency is approved.

Ian948

Posted: Thu Feb 3, 2022 11:39am

Ian948

Helpful member

Posts: 54

54 helpful points

Location: Caudete

Joined: 7 Nov 2019

Posted: Thu Feb 3, 2022 11:39am

I run all electric house ( except heating and hot water ) on solar. Original system was old ( 15 yrs ) and underpowered , I installed new system 5kw panels, and 15.4kw lithium storage , total cost installed 16k . Works extremely well , in 2 years only used my generator for less than 20 hours a year and that was never critical . All electrical appliances are A+++ and appliances includes 5 ac units . Completely off grid and never want to go back , best investment I have made.

Cheryl

Posted: Thu Feb 3, 2022 7:13pm

Cheryl

Legendary helpful member

Posts: 2973

3538 helpful points

Location: Albatera

Joined: 8 Jun 2017

Posted: Thu Feb 3, 2022 7:13pm

16K and it doesn't do your heating or hot water and still needs a back-up generator! That would take me over 13 years to save any money and that's assuming nothing goes wrong with it or parts need replacing.

Azphilosopher

Posted: Thu Feb 3, 2022 7:21pm

Posts: 20

14 helpful points

Location: Tibi

Joined: 19 Jul 2021

Posted: Thu Feb 3, 2022 7:21pm

Cheryl wrote on Thu Feb 3, 2022 7:13pm:

16K and it doesn't do your heating or hot water and still needs a back-up generator! That would take me over 13 years to save any money and that's assuming nothing goes wrong with it or parts need replacing.

Electric rates in parts of Spain can be extremely high and the payback much quicker than in other spots.  He clearly said he hasn't needed the backup generator and has 5 a/c units.  All modern A/C units will also heat with even less power draw than cooling.  However, if you have gas service or even home heating oil service it makes perfect sense for your heating and hot water to not be part of the solar system.  Sounds like it's not for you.  Eventually the world will all be using things like this.

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Cheryl

Posted: Thu Feb 3, 2022 8:16pm

Cheryl

Legendary helpful member

Posts: 2973

3538 helpful points

Location: Albatera

Joined: 8 Jun 2017

Posted: Thu Feb 3, 2022 8:16pm

Azphilosopher wrote on Thu Feb 3, 2022 7:21pm:

Electric rates in parts of Spain can be extremely high and the payback much quicker than in other spots.  He clearly said he hasn't needed the backup generator and has 5 a/c units.  All modern A/C units will also heat with even less power draw than cooling.  However, if you have ga...

...s service or even home heating oil service it makes perfect sense for your heating and hot water to not be part of the solar system.  Sounds like it's not for you.  Eventually the world will all be using things like this.

He clearly says back up was used 20 hours a year, not much, granted, but still another essential extra expense.
To me it basically means he has paid 16k up front for the next however many year's electric and pays separately for heating and hot water so not including heating from the air con and how long will the stored power last with 5 air con units all running at once, either heating or cooling? Having 5 air con units doesn't mean they are all on at once.

 I agree we are in a very expensive period for electricity but mine used to be about €70 a month which would then take 19 years to show any profit.

It would be for me if there were more grants available but 50% off IBI for 5 years and possibly a reduction in income tax (If fitted professionally) is not enough.

The OP asked for good and bad. I also know someone who paid thousands for a system to be installed professionally and for the whole week we stayed with them they had to rely on mains electric as one fault after another meant the engineers were there every day.

Ian948

Posted: Thu Feb 3, 2022 10:40pm

Ian948

Helpful member

Posts: 54

54 helpful points

Location: Caudete

Joined: 7 Nov 2019

Posted: Thu Feb 3, 2022 10:40pm

Cheryl wrote on Thu Feb 3, 2022 8:16pm:

He clearly says back up was used 20 hours a year, not much, granted, but still another essential extra expense.
To me it basically means he has paid 16k up front for the next however many year's electric and pays separately for heating and hot water so not including heating from the air con an...

...d how long will the stored power last with 5 air con units all running at once, either heating or cooling? Having 5 air con units doesn't mean they are all on at once.

 I agree we are in a very expensive period for electricity but mine used to be about €70 a month which would then take 19 years to show any profit.

It would be for me if there were more grants available but 50% off IBI for 5 years and possibly a reduction in income tax (If fitted professionally) is not enough.

The OP asked for good and bad. I also know someone who paid thousands for a system to be installed professionally and for the whole week we stayed with them they had to rely on mains electric as one fault after another meant the engineers were there every day.

I could manage with old generator for the amount I use it , possibly even none at all , but being belt n braces we wired in a new one in - it will probably outlast the house ! 

For central heat and hot water originally had gas , it was old , unreliable , and very expensive - replaced with a pellet boiler system that has performed really well and I will spend about 900 on pellets for the year , most of the time I could use solar for hot water as I have it wired into system , if I could be bothered , - the pellets are so good and cheap on hot water I just let it run in year round. ( using old system not nearly as much cost 3 times what our bill is now )

Also have pellet stove in living room for the fire effect and extra heat in winter.

Once we stop with central heat then we use 2 or 3 a/cs on heat to take the chill off of a morning.

I also run my pool pump from sun up to sun down most days , reduces chemicals required.

In summer on really hot day could run all 5 a/cs , and the pool pump and still have plenty spare. Of course only need a/c when sun out - could not run for long when dark - although left one on all night by mistake once not a big deal but all 5 would be !

It is not for everyone - I wanted a system that was designed for the long term 15-20 years , I have that at imo a price amortized over 10 years that I would easily have spent.

On a good day I will use between 24-30kw , because I have so much solar spare I use electric where ever I can !  ( I make around 5kw an hour ) Including all battery driven garden and general tools. My regret is I can't use all that I make and I can't afford to store it all - its a use it or lose it proposition.   

I do not miss utility bills at all.

However it is not for everybody , either suitable or practical , if my high demand for electric was mostly after dark that could be an issue because storage is expensive ( half my cost was storage ) , if all my appliances were old energy guzzlers again battery storage could be an issue .

And finally like all things there are good reliable systems and there those that are not , finding information can be overwhelming and that is where most problems begin .

Ian948

Posted: Thu Feb 3, 2022 10:56pm

Ian948

Helpful member

Posts: 54

54 helpful points

Location: Caudete

Joined: 7 Nov 2019

Posted: Thu Feb 3, 2022 10:56pm

Azphilosopher wrote on Wed Feb 2, 2022 9:22pm:

The house I bought near Tibi is equipped with solar panels and a battery system and is completely disconnected from the grid.  I recently spent nearly a month in the house (during the winter with low sun angles) and got quite a surprise when after a few days of clouds (which are rare in the ...

...region), my power began tripping off on under voltage.  Now the house has a backup generator but it's noisy and awkward to use.  I found myself becoming much more conscious of what types of appliances I could run.  You'll want to avoid as much as possible any with resistive heating elements in them.  Some examples are an electric kettle, toaster, electric space heaters.  LED lights use extremely little power.  Most motorized appliances are fairly energy efficient but you have to be aware of their current draw. 

I look forward to the summer months when the solar cells will be so much more efficient.  Whether my bank of batteries is sufficient, I'm not sure.  Now the good news.  The EU countries are extremely supportive of alternative energy and prices are inexpensive for decent systems.  I will probably add on to the system and storage so that I can install AC units on some rooms and I'm tempted to put up a small wind generator to see how much I can supplement on cloudy days.  If I find that I'm still lacking I'll be tempted to change the system to a grid-tie system if the electric utility will do that. 

For now it's great to know that I have no electrical costs to live in the house.  I look forward to being there full time once my residency is approved.

Azphilospher  - Great post , regarding wind turbines , I am embarrassed to say I have tried 3 - the last from Germany and a great product on the face of it , but between very poor installation and tiny amount of power on super windy days only , complete and absolute waste of money . Short of semi pro units starting around 10k wind in my experience has been a bust !

Also my system not suited ( I now find ) to wind systems for charging .

The reason we get less solar in winter is primarily a cause of solar hours - at least 2 or 3 times a winter I will get an over production time out ( few seconds ) because the panels produce much more when cold !  For example string of 3 panels run at about 120v normally , same string in winter - really cold day say 0-5c at the exact right angle to the sun will produce 150.1v which causes an over voltage error - lasts usually 2minutes or less but at 150.1v system alarms off on the production side . Scared me first time it happened - all automatically resets so no big deal but I was surprised at the difference. In summer we have more solar hours but efficiency is less .

Any connection to AZ ?   ( USA )

Azphilosopher

Posted: Fri Feb 4, 2022 6:01am

Posts: 20

14 helpful points

Location: Tibi

Joined: 19 Jul 2021

Posted: Fri Feb 4, 2022 6:01am

Ian948 wrote on Thu Feb 3, 2022 10:56pm:

Azphilospher  - Great post , regarding wind turbines , I am embarrassed to say I have tried 3 - the last from Germany and a great product on the face of it , but between very poor installation and tiny amount of power on super windy days only , complete and absolute waste of money . Short of...

... semi pro units starting around 10k wind in my experience has been a bust !

Also my system not suited ( I now find ) to wind systems for charging .

The reason we get less solar in winter is primarily a cause of solar hours - at least 2 or 3 times a winter I will get an over production time out ( few seconds ) because the panels produce much more when cold !  For example string of 3 panels run at about 120v normally , same string in winter - really cold day say 0-5c at the exact right angle to the sun will produce 150.1v which causes an over voltage error - lasts usually 2minutes or less but at 150.1v system alarms off on the production side . Scared me first time it happened - all automatically resets so no big deal but I was surprised at the difference. In summer we have more solar hours but efficiency is less .

Any connection to AZ ?   ( USA )

I am from Arizona yes.  I'm currently in Boston trying to get my residency.  Was too tough from that many time zones away to make the move.  However, the Boston consulate is horribly slow in responding.  My lawyer is about to complain to the Spanish government.  It's been 5 months now and no interview yet with them. 

I've read a lot about the wind turbines.  Very mixed experiences for people.  I think ultimately I'll just add more panels and double my storage.  Currently the system is lead acid batteries, the industrial kind but I know the lithium ones are better.  I wonder if you can mix them. 

I'm an electrician so I can probably save a lot of costs doing much of the work myself.  I don't think Spain is so precious on requiring local contractors.  I know one thing that would add a tremendous amount of efficiency to my system for the winter months and that's aligning the panels better.  Some are nearly flat on the roof.  Others are shielded by the rows in front of them.  I'm sure during the summer I'll have no real issues.

Ian948

Posted: Thu Feb 24, 2022 12:24pm

Ian948

Helpful member

Posts: 54

54 helpful points

Location: Caudete

Joined: 7 Nov 2019

Posted: Thu Feb 24, 2022 12:24pm

American here , mostly Texas and Colorado but spent about 10 yrs in and out if AZ , mainly Tucson , when we lived in Mexico . We enjoyed Tucson a lot , but boy did it grow !  Had an old system lead acid , 24v and by the time I made all the upgrades it was more efficient to just go whole new system 48v lithium . Probably the best investment I ever made !

Good luck with the consulate !

:-)

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