Quick (ever hopeful) tax question - Taxes in Torrevieja: Suma, NIE and general tax advice - Torrevieja forum - Costa Blanca forum in the Alicante province of Spain
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Quick (ever hopeful) tax question - Page 2

Shakingallover

Posted: Wed Mar 1, 2023 9:21pm

Posts: 113

19 helpful points

Location: Torrevieja

Joined: 23 Mar 2021

Posted: Wed Mar 1, 2023 9:21pm

John123456 wrote on Wed Mar 1, 2023 4:35pm:

Extract below from the following link with regards taxation of German State Pensions in Spain:

https://sede.agenciatributaria.gob.es/Sede/en_gb/ayuda/manuales-videos-folletos/folletos/folletos-residentes-rentas-extranjeras/alemania.html

Pension received on account of dependent work provided to the State, federal states, political subdivision or local authority, or legal entity under public law (Article 18.2 IDC). Their treatment is:

In general, these pensions would only be taxed in Germany.

In Spain they would be exempted, although the exemption would be applied progressively.This means that, if the taxpayer is obliged to file an income tax return to obtain other income, the amount of the exempt pension is taken into account in Spain to calculate the tax applicable to the remaining income.

However, if the pension beneficiary resident in Spain is of Spanish nationality, such pensions would only be taxed in Spain.

Hi John, thanks for the reply. To clarify .. does that mean I will pay German pension tax to Germany? Sorry .. I find taxes confusing.

Thanks again.

Ian

John123456

Posted: Wed Mar 1, 2023 9:55pm

John123456

Super helpful member

Posts: 1474

1070 helpful points

Location: Benidorm

Joined: 27 Feb 2021

Posted: Wed Mar 1, 2023 9:55pm

Shakingallover wrote on Wed Mar 1, 2023 9:21pm:

Hi John, thanks for the reply. To clarify .. does that mean I will pay German pension tax to Germany? Sorry .. I find taxes confusing.

Thanks again.

Ian

That is correct just as your UK State Pension would be taxable in the UK only, if any taxes were due on the amount you receive.

Shakingallover

Posted: Thu Mar 2, 2023 12:43pm

Posts: 113

19 helpful points

Location: Torrevieja

Joined: 23 Mar 2021

Posted: Thu Mar 2, 2023 12:43pm

John123456 wrote on Wed Mar 1, 2023 9:55pm:

That is correct just as your UK State Pension would be taxable in the UK only, if any taxes were due on the amount you receive.

Thank you John. I actually am living in Ireland and I pay taxes to the Irish tax system on my Irish and UK state pensions. But pay German tax on my German pension. Is this correct? Or should I be paying taxes to UK on my UK pension? Confusion reigns!!! Sorry for all the questions.

Thanks again.

Ian

John123456

Posted: Thu Mar 2, 2023 1:31pm

John123456

Super helpful member

Posts: 1474

1070 helpful points

Location: Benidorm

Joined: 27 Feb 2021

Posted: Thu Mar 2, 2023 1:31pm

Shakingallover wrote on Thu Mar 2, 2023 12:43pm:

Thank you John. I actually am living in Ireland and I pay taxes to the Irish tax system on my Irish and UK state pensions. But pay German tax on my German pension. Is this correct? Or should I be paying taxes to UK on my UK pension? Confusion reigns!!! Sorry for all the questions.

Thanks again.

Ian

My apologies for confusing you Ian. Tax on your UK state pension is payable only in Ireland. Just as I pay tax on my UK state pension in Spain only. I got myself confused with UK Cown pensions, which are taxed in the UK only and not Spain where I live. Sorry about that.

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Shakingallover

Posted: Thu Mar 2, 2023 2:17pm

Posts: 113

19 helpful points

Location: Torrevieja

Joined: 23 Mar 2021

Posted: Thu Mar 2, 2023 2:17pm

John123456 wrote on Thu Mar 2, 2023 1:31pm:

My apologies for confusing you Ian. Tax on your UK state pension is payable only in Ireland. Just as I pay tax on my UK state pension in Spain only. I got myself confused with UK Cown pensions, which are taxed in the UK only and not Spain where I live. Sorry about that.

Thank you very much John. You saved me sending an irate email to the guy who does my tax! He's not the sharpest knife in the box, as he had me paying Irish tax on my German pension .. until I got a tax demand from Germany!!!

Many thanks for your help.

Ian

John123456

Posted: Thu Mar 2, 2023 3:34pm

John123456

Super helpful member

Posts: 1474

1070 helpful points

Location: Benidorm

Joined: 27 Feb 2021

Posted: Thu Mar 2, 2023 3:34pm

Shakingallover wrote on Thu Mar 2, 2023 2:17pm:

Thank you very much John. You saved me sending an irate email to the guy who does my tax! He's not the sharpest knife in the box, as he had me paying Irish tax on my German pension .. until I got a tax demand from Germany!!!

Many thanks for your help.

Ian

Tax is confusing for all of us 😬. Thank God you queried what I had written. The moral of the story is 'engage brain before opening mouth'!

Stephanie M K

Posted: Sun Mar 5, 2023 9:55pm

Posts: 36

26 helpful points

Location: Villena

Joined: 30 Jul 2022

Posted: Sun Mar 5, 2023 9:55pm

John123456 wrote on Mon Feb 27, 2023 10:19pm:

Following your advice to this poster you may be interested in this statement:

Every year, the United Kingdom and Spain automatically exchange details. In total, 97 countries are now exchanging information automatically.

Quite so.

Way back in 2017 my hubby  received a registered letter from Agencia Tributaria Investigations Department which contained written information they had obtained direct from HMRC in respect  of his 4 UK pensions for the year 2016.  They were carrying out a random check and required certain listed documents to be sent to them within 10 days.  Luckily we had the items in our file for the 2016 Renta declaration.  All apart from a letter they required from the Civil Service, to confirm that his Civil Service pension was in fact covered by the Double Taxation Agreement. A phone call to the Civil Service was made and the appropriate letter was emailed to him direct. The lady there said that it was not uncommon for this request and that they have a tenplate letter for this exact situation even though Agencia Tributaria are fully aware the pension is covered by the Agreement.   

Three months later, he received a further registered letter from  Agencia Tributary Investigation Department to the effect that their investigation had been completed and no further action would be taken.

People be aware !!  The tax offices still talk to each other. Brexit has not changed this still in force agreement !!!!!!!!!

Kimmy11

Posted: Tue Mar 7, 2023 10:50am

Kimmy11

Legendary helpful member

Posts: 6872

12569 helpful points

Joined: 8 Aug 2017

Posted: Tue Mar 7, 2023 10:50am

Great post, Stephanie, thank you for sharing your experience.  

My sister, retired H.M. Inspector of Taxes, told me about data sharing between HMRC and AEAT before we moved to Spain - and Brexit hasn't affected their ongoing co-operation! 

Kind regards, 

Kim

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