The Covid problem - Page 3

garylamata wrote on Mon Sep 21, 2020 8:59pm:

Are you quoting the CFR (Case Fatality Rate), The IFR (Infection Fatality Rate) or the CMR (Crude Mortality Rate).

All differ, ever changing, disputed country by country. Some countries differ wildly in their death recording types.

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There is no set science here. People are not believing this as credible. The world is turning against the official stats.

Populations are deciding to take the risk - as the risk is now being seen as less dangerous , far more some than deaths from all the other causes now going untreated by hospitals worldwide. People die. We will never have a zero death rate. It is now very clear that Covid conditions on society is causing more deaths than Covid. So, even looking at the grim numbers taking a ratio of death vs. death type we need to get back to normal and stop hiding away like rats.

Best regards

G

Dagurney wrote on Mon Sep 21, 2020 9:06pm:

What is your source for claiming that there are more deaths as a result of Covid incidentals than from the virus itself?

garylamata wrote on Mon Sep 21, 2020 9:16pm:

It's a personal opinion based on deaths I have witnessed which were due to Covid-biased non-treatment by the NHS.

I also do not know anyone who has died from Covid not has anyone I have spoken to.

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I realise this is not scientific but as I stated I do not believe the official figures and do not have access to the real tally. I can only go by what I have seen and feel is the truth. I do not believe most of what comes out of Boris's mouth nor do I believe Hancock or their appointed scientists.  Their total mismanagement and distruction of the UK economy leads me to doubt them in all areas.

As the saying goes, there are lies, damned lies and statistics.

G

Dagurney wrote on Mon Sep 21, 2020 9:43pm:

I really don’t like Boris and Co. but it is a bit paranoid to believe it is some sort of conspiracy or that they are purposely messing up. All 4 national chief medical officers are going on the same science - the only difference I can see is Boris was a bit hung ho to keep his shareholders happ...

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...y- but essential all 4 nations have done the same thing except some like Nicola Sturgeon were more cautious. This is a novel virus and we still don’t know what it does and how it will behave in future. Bottom line science is not the god we all thought it was!

garylamata wrote on Mon Sep 21, 2020 8:59pm:

Are you quoting the CFR (Case Fatality Rate), The IFR (Infection Fatality Rate) or the CMR (Crude Mortality Rate).

All differ, ever changing, disputed country by country. Some countries differ wildly in their death recording types.

Read more...

There is no set science here. People are not believing this as credible. The world is turning against the official stats.

Populations are deciding to take the risk - as the risk is now being seen as less dangerous , far more some than deaths from all the other causes now going untreated by hospitals worldwide. People die. We will never have a zero death rate. It is now very clear that Covid conditions on society is causing more deaths than Covid. So, even looking at the grim numbers taking a ratio of death vs. death type we need to get back to normal and stop hiding away like rats.

Best regards

G

Cookep1 wrote on Mon Sep 21, 2020 10:11pm:

Sorry thought I was clear, I'm using the mortality rate you quoted earlier in this thread. That, multiplied by the predicted infection rate given by the CMO/CSO at thus press conference today is what creates the predicted no of deaths in this scenario of 182,000. 

In terms of incidental Covid-19 deaths there are undoubtedly a significant number. Simplistically if you take the number of excess deaths (ONS data) and subtract Covid-19 deaths (Gov figure so?) Then the incidental deaths total ~20,000...

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...

But I agree with the last part, as I've said throughout this thread, there has to be progress and continual lockdowns are not realistic. But this pandemic will change the face of employment. Businesses are already looking at the long term advantages of WFH and governments at climate based economic models. So maybe there is some positives to come from this.

Paul

GCfromVC wrote on Mon Sep 21, 2020 10:03am:

My thoughts on this Covid pandemic are completely another matter and couldn't even post on this site without the backlash of comments that I would get.

Countries and economies need to move on but as safe as possible before we are all ruined for many years to come.

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So the answer to your question Gary in my own humble opinion would be to "target measures".

I understand your post but can also understand Steve's comment, but I'm assuming you just want to get a feel for this from the members.

Gilly09 wrote on Tue Sep 22, 2020 10:38pm:

There is much more going on behind the scenes here.  While everyone is worrying and panicking about this virus, things are fundamentally changing around the Globe, especially in the West.  Liberties are being chipped away on an hourly basis, many many things are being taken away from lo...

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...cal areas to be controlled centrally.  So many services are being automated and taking out the human interaction.  This is to get the population prepared, in order to get used to the idea of integrating with AI.  It's no secret, it has been planned for years, it is almost here.  If you want to research, I'd start out with Elon Musk and go from there.  We're on the brink of going too far to turn back if we don't push back now.  Get educated before it's absolutely too late.

Forget worrying about the virus.  Keep vulnerable people protected sensibly.  It is here to stay.  We have to get herd immunity eventually, and locking the country up is only delaying the inevitable.  Let it happen and concentrate on what this is really all about.

Cookep1 wrote on Tue Sep 22, 2020 10:50pm:

Re: herd immunity. All evidence to date is that this is not achievable as Covid-19 antibodies only remain for 2-3 months after infection.