Lobby to negotiate equal visa rights for U.K. citizens with property in EU area - Page 14

Hi,

Looking at this with interest as wanting to buy in Spain, but terms of non lucrative visa too restrictive for me (don't want to spend 183+ days in Spain, family commitments in UK etc, but more than 90/180 during spring / summer etc). 

However, France do a visa for a straight 180 days (you have to have a property of some sort), and we hoped (assumed) that Spain would have a similar thing. We've had a static caravan in France for 20+ years and have used the French 180 day visa, but wanted to upgrade to a nice house in Spain. Looks like we may have to stay in France and upgrade there

Hi,

I'm surprised to hear of this, as France is a member of the Schengen travel zone where, post-Brexit, you can only stay 90 days in a rolling 180 days.  Please would you provide your source for a French visa that allows UK citizens to stay for a continuous 180  days?

Thanks and regards, 

Kim

Thats odd about France, as it goes against all other Schengen countries that drew up the Schengen agreement.

Hi Kim,

I've got the visa in my passport - it allows us to stay in France for up to 180 days in a 6 month period (in my case, from 09.06.2021 to 08.12.2021) applied for through:

https://france-visas.gouv.fr/web/france-visas/long-stay-visa

The French govt use a company called TLS to process applications, cost (from memory) was around 99€ each plus admin costs, around £230 in total for the pair of us. 

You get the option of a 12 month visa allowing over 180 days (residence), or a 6 month visa for 180 days.

The Schenghen thing is the reason we assumed that we could get the same thing in Spain, but France are obviously out of step. Hopefully they'll stay out of step as we will remain in France I think.

I should add, it is a tourist visa - you can't do any form of employment. /self employment or even voluntary work.

Cheers

Chris

Thanks Chris.  The site is currently down for maintenance, so I'll try again tomorrow.  Did you obtain the French tourist visa this year, or before Brexit?

Kind regards, 

Kim

This is getting properly interesting now because it's virgin territory on here; genuinely new info.

And it potentially opens a lot of doors.

Provided Johnson & the UK Govt play with a straight bat & act like grown-ups.

Ah...just spotted the inherent flaw...

As you were, folks.

Hi Kim

We applied in April this year - post Brexit. you have to have an address in France and proof etc - much the same kind of stuff as the Spanish non lucrative visa. 
cheers

Chri

Hi Stan,

I could understand France being able to vary their visa rules if they had opted out of Schengen, but it doesn't make sense for them to be a member of Schengen and for the EU to allow them.to ignore the 90/180 rule.  Also, maybe a typo, but odd that Chris says the tourist visa "....allows us to stay in France for up to 180 days in a 6 month period..." because 180 days = 6 months.  

Since leaving the EU, the UK allows EU citizens to visit for 180 days in a 12 month period, and I'm not aware that the UK makes that dependent on property ownership.  I'll check it out - and the French visa site, once it's back on line.  If the EU has allowed an exception (precedent?) to Schengen to exist, then perhaps there is hope for non-resident property owners in Spain too 🤞  

Although the other "fly in the ointment" could be Gibraltar 😄

Kind regards, 

Kim

Unfortunately, the site at Chris's link is still down.  However, I've had a look at Schengen which confirms that UK citizens don't need a Tourist visa for visits to France up to a maximum of 90 days.  For visits exceeding 90 days, a Long-stay visa is required, which is detailed at this French government agency website:

"Applying for a long-stay visa for France - Welcome to France" https://www.welcometofrance.com/en/fiche/applying-for-a-long-stay-visa

The opening paragraph states, "A long-stay visa allows foreign nationals to stay in France for longer than 3 months, with the aim of enabling the holder TO OBTAIN A RESIDENCE PERMIT so they can live in France for a specified period."  

So this isn't a way of getting around the 90/180 Schengen rules.  You may get away with it for one 6 month period, but if you don't apply for a French residence permit, your visa expires and then you're back to square one.  If you tried to apply for a further visa after the first year, I would expect the French authorities to ask why the applicant hadn't applied for a residence permit during the original visa period.

Until the other website is back up, it's impossible to say whether France offers a specific long-stay visa that allows Third Country Nationals to stay for more than 3 months without applying for residency.

Kind regards,

Kim

This seems a good idea and I wholeheartedly support it but I doubt there is much chance of success as Spain is merely applying pre-existing pertaining to third-party nationals to the UK now that we have inexplicably opted to acquire that status.  As I understand it, in reality nothing has changed.  Even prior to Brexit, one was allowed to stay only ninety days in Spain, whereupon one was required to leave or seek residency. As we were EU citizens, this was never enforced and most people never knew about this provision but it obviously underpinned the 90/180 rule which some people tried to adhere to. Noone has ever been able to explain this rule to me although it is suggested that it existed to suggest a parity with the law relating to third party nationals. It seems unlikely then that Spain will change its stance given that it is in no way discriminatory towards the UK and has long been enshrined in Spanish law.