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Kimmy11

Posted: Fri Nov 22, 2019 5:46pm

Kimmy11

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Posted: Fri Nov 22, 2019 5:46pm

BikerMan BMW wrote on Thu Nov 21, 2019 2:38pm:

If the EU parliament has no power to do what it votes for, why does it exist?

Hi BikerMan,

Your comment misrepresents what the OP said:

"The EU has no control over domestic sentencing of its members."

This is probably the most important element that so many Brexiteers have been unable to understand: the UK has, and has always had, control over our Sovereign state, be that financial, taxation, judiciary, etc.  As a member of the EU, we have contributed to the overarching rules and regulations, but how these are introduced to UK domestic policies and laws is laid down by the UK government, and similarly by the governments of other individual member states in their own countries.

For example, have you ever wondered why the UK's income tax rates are different to Spain's?  Currently in the UK, an individual can earn £11,850 per year without paying tax.  In Spain, the tax-free personal allowance starts at only Eu 5,500.  Do you think that's just one, or both, countries ignoring EU rules?  No, it's because individual member states decide their own domestic policy and laws.


The EU doesn't 'do' things to the UK, the UK is the EU - as is Spain, France, Germany and all the other member states.  We were a strong and influential member of the European Union.  As others have said, the EU is not perfect, but as a member of the 'club' we had the power to influence and contribute to change.  Once the UK leaves the EU, we lose that influence and control.

Kind regards,

Kim

BikerMan BMW

Posted: Fri Nov 22, 2019 6:06pm

BikerMan BMW

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Joined: 21 Oct 2018

Posted: Fri Nov 22, 2019 6:06pm

Once the UK leaves the EU, we lose that influence and control..   We neither need nor want to control them.  The point is that if you say we could influence control it also means we were subject to the control of the others.  Britain being outvoted the majority of the time.  We saw Cameron trying to wrest some control back.  He got short shrift did he not?  Surely this being the subject of control by others is at the heart of the reason for Brexit.  BoJos acceptance of the "level playing field"  is a disaster and ids a way that the EU will continue in future controlling the UK just as it has in the past.

TheRower

Posted: Fri Nov 22, 2019 6:14pm

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Posted: Fri Nov 22, 2019 6:14pm

Kimmy11 wrote on Fri Nov 22, 2019 5:46pm:

Hi BikerMan,

Your comment misrepresents what the OP said:

"The EU has no control over domestic sentencing of its members."

This is probably the most important element that so many Brexiteers have been unable to understand: the UK has, and has always had, control over our Sovereign state, be that financial, taxation, judiciary, etc.  As a member of the EU, we have contributed to the overarching rules and regulations, but how these are introduced to UK domestic policies and laws is laid down by the UK government, and similarly by the governments of other individual member states in their own countries.

For example, have you ever wondered why the UK's income tax rates are different to Spain's?  Currently in the UK, an individual can earn £11,850 per year without paying tax.  In Spain, the tax-free personal allowance starts at only Eu 5,500.  Do you think that's just one, or both, countries ignoring EU rules?  No, it's because individual member states decide their own domestic policy and laws.


The EU doesn't 'do' things to the UK, the UK is the EU - as is Spain, France, Germany and all the other member states.  We were a strong and influential member of the European Union.  As others have said, the EU is not perfect, but as a member of the 'club' we had the power to influence and contribute to change.  Once the UK leaves the EU, we lose that influence and control.

Kind regards,

Kim

Sorry, Kimmy but I think it's incorrect to say the UK has control over its Financial and judiciary affairs. 

The UK must adopt policies that meet EU criteria under the SGP pact. Potentially fined if they do not meet the rules. https://www.investopedia.com/terms/s/stability-growth-pact.asp

The UK courts are required not to enforce UK laws to the extent that they are incompatible with EU obligations. https://ukandeu.ac.uk/fact-figures/does-eu-law-take-precedence-over-uk-law/

Kimmy11

Posted: Fri Nov 22, 2019 11:00pm

Kimmy11

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Posted: Fri Nov 22, 2019 11:00pm

BikerMan BMW wrote on Fri Nov 22, 2019 6:06pm:

Once the UK leaves the EU, we lose that influence and control..   We neither need nor want to control them.  The point is that if you say we could influence control it also means we were subject to the control of the others.  Britain being outvoted the majority of the time.&nb...

...sp; We saw Cameron trying to wrest some control back.  He got short shrift did he not?  Surely this being the subject of control by others is at the heart of the reason for Brexit.  BoJos acceptance of the "level playing field"  is a disaster and ids a way that the EU will continue in future controlling the UK just as it has in the past.

"Britain being outvoted most of the time".  Examples and references please.

Charles123

Posted: Fri Nov 22, 2019 11:17pm

Posts: 9

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Joined: 28 Sep 2019

Posted: Fri Nov 22, 2019 11:17pm

Going back to the House of Lords as the final appeal court? That sounds very representative of the British people!!!!!!

The EU is where we share or pool some elements of our sovernity in exchange for membership of one of the biggest trading blocks in the World. Everybody does this, germans, french and the little nations alike. The EU has guaranteed peace in Europe and trump wants to destroy it and NATO to make America great again!!!

Lets not play that game.

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BikerMan BMW

Posted: Sat Nov 23, 2019 7:18am

BikerMan BMW

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Posted: Sat Nov 23, 2019 7:18am

I am sure wikipedia will give you that info.  If the UK govt wanted to reduce VAT on domestic fuel; could it do so?  NO.  Remember the tampon tax?

BikerMan BMW

Posted: Sat Nov 23, 2019 7:31am

BikerMan BMW

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Posted: Sat Nov 23, 2019 7:31am

Between 2009 and 2015 the UK voted against the majority 12.3% of the time, compared to 2.6% of the time between 2004 and 2009.

That made it the country most likely to be on the losing side during the later period—the closest competitors were Germany and Austria, which were on the losing side 5.4% of the time.


TheRower

Posted: Sat Nov 23, 2019 8:26am

TheRower

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Posts: 496

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Joined: 1 Jan 2017

Posted: Sat Nov 23, 2019 8:26am

Charles123 wrote on Fri Nov 22, 2019 11:17pm:

Going back to the House of Lords as the final appeal court? That sounds very representative of the British people!!!!!!

The EU is where we share or pool some elements of our sovernity in exchange for membership of one of the biggest trading blocks in the World. Everybody does this, germans, french and the little nations alike. The EU has guaranteed peace in Europe and trump wants to destroy it and NATO to make Ame...

...rica great again!!!

Lets not play that game.

As an EU member state, The House of Lords (now The Supreme Court) is obliged to make decisions in line with EU law.

BikerMan BMW

Posted: Sat Nov 23, 2019 10:17am

BikerMan BMW

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Posts: 48

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Location: Pinoso / El Pinós

Joined: 21 Oct 2018

Posted: Sat Nov 23, 2019 10:17am

peace in Europe ????   The new president of the EU commision has said.  "The EU needs its army.  The EU needs to be able to flex its muscles"   Peace has endured in Europe because of NATO.  It is the EU that wishes to weaken NATO.  One of the leading figures has said that NATO does not want to get involved in Sub Saharan Africa.  The EU has interests there  and the EU needs an independent force from NATO to be able to intervene there.

Do these comments sound "peaceful" to you.

Kelvin1960

Posted: Sat Nov 23, 2019 11:31am

Kelvin1960

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Posted: Sat Nov 23, 2019 11:31am

BikerMan BMW wrote on Sat Nov 23, 2019 7:31am:

Between 2009 and 2015 the UK voted against the majority 12.3% of the time, compared to 2.6% of the time between 2004 and 2009.

That made it the country most likely to be on the losing side during the later period—the closest competitors were Germany and Austria, which were on the losing side 5.4% of the time....

...


This comment needs context....  here it is

https://fullfact.org/europe/eu-facts-behind-claims-uk-influence/

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