New EU rules - Page 2

Putting it in very simple terms, you can't just 'nip over' to Spain for a year any more.

After 90 days you would be in breach of immigration rules. That in itself could result in a future Residency application being refused.

If you have decided to move to Spain, or thinking about it, that's a big life changing decision that needs careful consideration because it has serious ramifications, in particular you lose UK health care, need Private Health Insurance in Spain and become tax resident in Spain. Plus you need to meet the financial savings/income criteria. It needs a lot of research and contemplation. 

It can be done, you just need to understand how it works, so if you want to know more keep asking questions, there's lots of helpful and patient people here.

Steve

I think that the UK should apply these rules to the Spanish and see how many of them would have to leave and go back to Spain because I know they are not learning the criteria that the Spanish wants us to show how can you be earning £26,000 a year when you are retired

EU nationals can only visit UK for six months, unless they already have settled status. To stay longer they will need to meet the UK points based immigration criteria. I think you’ll find the earnings levels are similar to those required to live in Spain. 

The UK government have always been able to enforce the rules!  It sounds, with respect, that you have been reading the gutter press rather than checking the actual rules and regulations that surrounded FoM.  The UK never bothered to enforce the rules surrounding Freedom of Movement laws.  In fact most EU countries have been lax about it - the rule was always no stay longer than 90 days without permission from the country to stay longer and for that 90 days you had to be self-supporting with medical insurance.  If you wanted to stay longer you needed to meet the requirements, which in the UK included that you either worked and paid into the system or were able to remain self-supporting with medical insurance.  Now the UK is out of the Single Market the immigration requirements required for EU citizens are the same as they are for most other non-commonwealth countries (Malta and Cyprus in CW).  Fortunately anyone already living legally in Spain is protected by the WA so doesn't need to prove the new levels of income.  Remember, it is the UK who have changed the rules for UK citizens wishing to live/retire to Spain, not the Spanish!

Yes I understand but what I know for a fact the level of income the Spanish has set Spanish people are not getting anywhere near that in in wages and also it has put people off who I know of buying houses now in Spain which I hope will make the property market drop to zero if you are retired you cannot learn £26,000 a year and the Spanish do not even here not themselves

It isn't just a rule for Brits, it is the existing rule for Third Country Nationals.  The rule is 4xIPREM for TCNs and has been for many years (certain Latin American countries excluded as under different rules).  It is reviewed annually, just done, so goes up each year.  The UK government changed Brits to TCNs so existing TCN rules now apply to Brits.  Are you saying Spain should not set it's own immigration rules for non-EU/SM citizens?  Or that for some reason Brits should be exempt or have special status?  Yes, it will be more difficult for Brits to retire to Spain, but that's a direct result of actions taken by the UK, not Spain.

Hi Thomasb,

No, a lot of Spanish people don't earn the income/savings levels required of Third Country Nationals wanting to take residency in Spain, but similarly, there are thousands of low-income UK citizens who can't meet the financial requirements placed on foreigners wanting to move to the UK either; I can't see the relevance of your argument.

I'm sorry that you can't meet TCN requirements set by Spain, but non-EU citizens have been moving to and living here for decades, and will continue to do so, but I suspect that those people moving between countries in future are more likely to come from a younger age group.

Hoping that "the property market" will "drop to zero" may make you feel better, but it isn't going to help anyone and if you already owned property in Spain, I doubt you'd think that way.

Regards,  

Kim

Leaving aside the Brexit point, the interesting thing for me is that while the visiting requirements are consistent for TCNs across the entire EU, the financial requirements to move permanently to a country vary wildly. Additionally, the requirements for partners/dependents are also different.

Obviously, there are "golden" or "investment" type visas which circumvent the ongoing income requirements but for most people they will simply not be a realistic or affordable option. 

Taking a single person (given the partner point above would just muddy the waters as requirements on that also vary):

Spain - IPREM x 4 = 6.778,80 € * 4 = 27.115,20 € annual income requirement 

Portugal - Equal to Minimum Wage = 635,00  € * 12 = 7.620  € annual income requirement 

France - Monthly Minimum Working Wage (SMIC) x 12 = €1,555 gross * 12 = 18.660,00  € annual income requirement 

The differential between Spain and Portugal's approach surprised me alot but what I've not looked into is what other "requirements" might come with it around healthcare etc etc. I was purely trying to find the stand alone financial numbers.

While nothing is likely to move in the short terms, it will be interesting to see to what extent if any there is some harmonisation on that - after all, the cost of living is not wildly different between the 3 countries above.

Links for non-Spain detail

Portugal’s D7 Visa & Residence Permit – Portugalist

Moving to France After Brexit (french-property.com)

Firstly, have you ever looked at the income levels demand for most immigrants to the UK?  They are far higher than national average wage.  Second, why would you wish for the the Spanish property market to drop to zero and cause financial ruin for millions?  Not nice, and a very vindictive and thoughtless comment.  Third, SOME people do have an excellent retirement income, not the majority I agree, or they may qualify with the capital reserves they have, so making a sweeping statement about retirees not being able to move to Spain isn't accurate - it will affect many but not all.  

Brits have used their FoM for many years, it seems many having done so without appreciating that it is one of the privileges of EU/SM membership.  Blame those who voted to change the status of Brits and the UK government for deciding to leave the SM, not Spain, for the change in status and move to becoming a TCN.  It is a big disappointment for many.  Maybe Spain will review this in the future but on the other hand they may not see any need to make a special case for Brits, why should they?  Personally I think Spain will court the other SM countries more to compensate for the loss of Brits , after all, most of Spain is not dependent on British retirees to fund the local economy so the only real losses will be felt in the Brit 'colonies' where the locals chose not to integrate after emigrating.

I've been following this thread and it seems you don't have the ability to understand what has changed and why it has changed. 

In simple terms

UK voted to leave the EU

UK citizens no longer are EU citizens 

Non EU citizens have to comply with the new situation they have chosen

How hard can it be?

Knocking Spain like that shows an inability to understand who is really to blame for this, and a very nasty bitter attitude which is completely misplaced.